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Loading Origin Guarantees

The Loading Origin Guarantees (LOGs) program is a centerbeam flatcar, boxcar, refrigerated boxcar, gondola, and bulkhead flatcar guaranteed placement program.



Next Offer:

4 weeks (ships 06/11/2012 - 07/08/2012)

For questions, please e-mail:

Guarantees Offered: Monday May 14, 2012

Car Type Guarantees Offered Per Week
60 Ft Plate F Boxcars 78 (n) 25 (s)
50/52 Ft Plate F Boxcars 81 (n) 15 (s)
General Boxcars (Could be Plate F's) 120 (n) 20 (s)
81 Ft Centerbeams 29  
73 Ft Centerbeams 771  
60 Ft Centerbeams 20  
Bulkhead Flat = or < 62 Ft (Lumber) 63  

n=North Region; s=South Region

Bulkhead Flat note: BNSF will supply Bulkhead Flats of various sizes, 56, 60 or 62 foot, based on availability, to Bulkhead Flat permit holders.

Bid Results:

Results for May 7, 2012

Future Auctions 

Cars Offered Cars Sold Premium Amount Duration Offered Duration Sold
60 Ft Plate F Boxcars 81 (N) /
25 (S)
3 (N) /
0 (S)
$0 4 4
50/52 Ft Plate F Boxcars 81 (N) /
15 (S)
0 (N) /
0 (S)
  4  
General Boxcars 120(N) /
20 (S)
0 (N) /
0 (S)
  4  
81 Ft Centerbeams 29 0   4  
73 Ft Centerbeams 771 0   4  
60 Ft Centerbeams 20 0   4  
Bulkhead Flats (less than 62 Ft) 63 0   4  

Other Information

Freight Deduction Matrix
Bid Calendar 
Program Overview 

  (Get Adobe® Reader®)


Important updates for the BNSF LOGs program

For years, BNSF Railway's Loading Origin Guarantees (LOGs) program has helped our shippers get the empty equipment they need - guaranteed - by securing equipment in advance. Below are some exciting enhancements to the LOGs program.

Follow the links below for general news and to learn how the LOGs program is being fine-tuned:


LOGS can be transferred in any quantity. All transfers must be approved by BNSF by contacting the LOGS Manager. Written notification of desire to transfer must be received by 4:00 p.m. CST on Friday so that transferees may order equipment by the Monday, 4:00 p.m. CST deadline. For general LOGs information, please contact LOGs administrator at 817-867-LOGS or e-mail .

# of Cars Week of Posting
Type
Car Type Contact
3 05/28/12 - 06/10/12 Offered 65 & 66 FOOT GONDOLA - METALS IRMA 915-532-6981
1 05/28/12 - 02/10/13 Requested 73 FOOT CENTERBEAMS MARTHA 248-683-9145

Fax Forms

The following files are in PDF format (Get Adobe® Reader®)

Frequently Asked Questions

Bid Form Access

Program Overview


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What is the Loading Origin Guarantees program?

The Loading Origin GuaranteeS (LOGs) program is a guaranteed equipment placement program for rail transportation of commodities shipped in certain BNSF controlled equipment types. LOGs is reciprocal: customers commit to BNSF (by purchasing a LOG during a Monday auction) to order and utilize BNSF equipment in the committed weekly quantities and BNSF commits to the customer a guarantee to fulfill that equipment order within specified time limits. A failure on either party's commitment to the other results in a penalties due the other. In some cases, as within the Public Rate Program, LOGs also offers a freight discount.

"BNSF controlled" is defined as equipment owned by or leased to BNSF. Equipment types included in this program are currently plain boxcars, refrigerated boxcars, insulated boxcars, pulpboard boxcars, 60 ft, 73 ft, and 81 ft centerbeam equipment, gondolas and bulkhead flats.

Minimum weekly volume commitments are required. Currently they are 1 car per week for all equipment offered.

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Why did BNSF start the LOGs Program?

Loading Origins Guarantees was designed to target our customers' top 2 areas of importance (as defined in the 1999 Ease of Doing Business Survey conducted by BNSF) equipment availability and consistency. LOGs is a GUARANTEED equipment supply and placement program between BNSF and its customers. The goal is better planning for both parties. BNSF has invited other railroads to participate on a joint-line basis via joint-line documents. Our objective is to offer a program encompassing any movement in North America.

Please Note: This program is also an extension of BNSF's Public Rate program. Where applicable, BNSF will share economic efficiencies gained through advanced shipment commitment with a freight discount program on some BNSF Public Price Documents (see Price Documents for a list of which BNSF public documents are eligible for a freight discount.) Participation in the LOGs program is not a requirement to do business with BNSF.

The overriding objective is to give the customer a very high comfort level of car supply and want-date placement by a guaranteed placement program. The LOGs process will also be used to assist BNSF in fleet sizing. The LOGs program, in conjunction with a BNSF Public Price Program will allow rate transparency to the industry, where applicable.

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Is the LOGs program only for large shippers?

No. LOGs are available to all shippers both large and small, any company willing to commit to the weekly minimums of the desired equipment types. (See "What is Loading Origins Guarantees Program?")

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Is LOGs mandatory, and are there other options?

LOGs is NOT mandatory. As stated previously, the LOGs program provides an additional shipping option. The LOGs program provides an alternative for customers who need guaranteed car supply and are able to plan advanced shipping needs. Portions of our fleets offered in LOGs remain available through standard equipment ordering options.

For some equipment types, SWAPS is another shipper option: BNSF shortline partners and private companies with their own centerbeam equipment may enroll their fleets into the BNSF LOGs program via a SWAPS process.
Any party interested in becoming a SWAPS partner can e-mail or call 817-867-LOGs.

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What are the eligible equipment types, and what if I need more than one type?

The LOGs program is currently offering BNSF controlled 60 ft, 73 ft, and 81 ft centerbeams, refrigerated boxcars, plain boxcars, insulated boxcars, pulpboard boxcars, gondolas, and bulkhead flatcars for bid in LOGs auctions for guaranteed placement. "BNSF controlled" is defined as equipment owned by or leased to BNSF.

Customers needing more than one of these equipment types should bid on each equipment type separately. Each equipment type will have a separate permit number assigned to it. Hence, separate orders will have to be placed using each permit number.

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How are cars allocated between LOGs shipments and non-LOGs shipments?

The number of cars being offered is based on historical shipments calculated for each shipping region (stated above). Current marketing and car velocity information will then be considered to make a final determination of the number of cars to be offered. Cars offered and not sold in the LOGs program will be returned to non-LOGs general service.

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How does BNSF determine annual fleet size?

BNSF's annual fleet size is determined by current and projected demand for freight equipment. Demand is derived from historical shipping data combined with available industry data and private forecasts along with origin and destination customer input.

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What is the purpose of the LOGs FAQs?

The LOGs FAQs should be viewed as a helpful tool for understanding the LOGs program.  The official rules for the program can be found in LOGs Rules Book, BNSF-7. We ask anyone having questions or comments about the program to please contact the LOGs Manager at 817-867-LOGS (5647).  For further clarification of any point, please e-mail . Please use a left mouse click on any information underlined and in blue to link to more information.

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Securing a LOGs Permit


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How do customers qualify to participate in LOGs?

LOGs holders or LOGs participants must have established credit in good standing with BNSF find out how to establish credit with BNSF. The reason established credit is required is because all LOGs are contracts between BNSF and LOGs holder for placement and future shipment with BNSF. A LOGs holder is defined as a customer (i.e. company) that owns a LOG held in the customer's name. A LOGs participant is defined as either a LOGs holder or a customer who receives equipment obtained through authorized transfer of LOGs.

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How do participants bid in an auction?

After establishing credit, customers must register as a LOGs BIDDER on the MyBNSF webpage. Once registered as a LOGs BIDDER, the LOGs BID FORMS are added to the customers user profile and these are used to submit LOGs bids during weekly LOGs auctions. (See "How does a customer submit a bid?".)

To add the LOGs Bid Forms to a customer's existing user profile contact BNSF Electronic Commerce at 888-428-2673. Or, select "Request Access" after you have signed on to MyBNSF.

If you do not have a user ID for access to MyBNSF Web applications click here for more information on registration.

Please Note: If you already have a user ID for access to BNSF Web Applications, it is not necessary to obtain a new user ID in order to add a new application to your BNSF e.Business page menu.

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What are the steps necessary to participate in a LOGs auction?

A qualified customer desiring to bid on a LOG must 1) Register for LOGs bid forms on myBNSF.com 2) Review BNSF LOG offers 3) Submit a bid for desired LOG commitment and 4) If awarded a LOG, remit any premium due.

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When do LOGs auctions take place?

BNSF will hold a LOGs auction every Monday at 10 a.m. CST (8 a.m. PST), excluding railroad holidays. The bidding will close at 4 p.m. CST (2 p.m. PST) on Monday (same day as offer).

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How does a customer submit a bid?

Registered bidders will have the opportunity to bid via the BNSF e.Business page using the LOGs Bid Forms during weekly LOGs auctions.

In case of technology failures, a bid may be submitted by sending an e-mail to or by calling 817-867-LOGS with the following information:

  1. Date
  2. Company Contact Name
  3. Bidder's Company Name
  4. Type of Car
  5. Bidder's Telephone Number
  6. Contact's E-mail address
  7. Number of LOGs cars requested
  8. Shipping Origin Region (North or South)
  9. Shipping Period requested
  10. Premium Amount ($/car)
    Please Note: If you have not received an Internet confirmation of bid within two (2) days, please contact us at 817-867-LOGS.

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What determines a winning LOGs bid?

Priority will be given first to duration, i.e. longer time frame commitments, then the highest premium amount will receive the LOGs until all are sold. If tied bids exceed the number of cars available, the bidders are asked to re-bid.

Example:
Sample offer– 500 LOGs (Cars per week).
Bid (1) 100 LOGs per week for four weeks bid of $10 per car
Bid (2) 200 LOGs per week for four weeks bid of $10 per car
Bid (3) 200 LOGs per week for 12 weeks bid of $5 per car
Bid (4) 200 LOGs per week for 24 weeks bid of $4 per car

Bids 3 and 4 will be accepted because they are for the longest time frame. Bids 1 and 4 would pay $0 since the demand is met with the available supply. Bid 1 and 2 will not be accepted because there are not enough remaining guarantees available (100) to satisfy the requests of the tie bids (300). The remaining 100 LOGs will be re-offered in a special auction for tie bidders only.

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How will customers know if they have secured a LOGs bid?

By close of business CST on Tuesday, winning bidders will be notified via e-mail of the “Confirmation Award Statement” including a LOGs permit number. The customer's e-mail address from the profile information under My BNSF will be used to send e-mail notification to the customer. All bidders will be notified.  Also, BNSF will publish the number of LOGs sold and the range of winning bids on this website.

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Now that a customer has received a LOGs Confirmation Award Statement notification, what is the process from here?

Step 1: To secure the LOG, any premium bid (above $0) is considered a prepayment and the lump-sum premium payment (example, $1 premium on one 25 car four week LOG would be-- $1 premium x 25 weekly cars x 4 # of weeks = $100) must be paid through account status or via wire transfer by close of business the two business days following bill availability in account status. Specific wire instructions will be provided with winner's e-mail notification.

Please note: The LOG identification number must accompany the prepayment transfer. When BNSF is notified of lump sum prepayment by Bank of America, the LOG bid process is considered completed.

Step 2: For ease of doing business, BNSF retains custody of customer LOGs in a paperless format. However, customers may request a written LOG certificate by submitting a written request to the address shown below. This is a free service.

Manager, LOGs
BNSF Railway
PO Box 961065
2650 Lou Menk Drive
Fort Worth, TX 76161-0065

The purpose of a paperless LOG is to relieve customers of the administrative burden of a paper LOG.

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Ordering LOGs Equipment


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How do I order LOGs equipment?

LOGs equipment requests should be placed via electronic Equipment Request on this website. Once you have been awarded a LOG, you will need to have your Internet equipment request profiles updated to include LOGs-designated equipment types. (Electronic equipment Requests is a requirement for LOGs participation.) If your facility is not already registered for electronic Equipment Request, you can register on the BNSF Registration page.

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When do I order LOGs equipment?

The deadline for ordering LOGs equipment is the Monday 4 p.m. CST prior to the LOGs equipment "want week", where "want-week" is defined as Monday through Sunday.

Example: equipment wanted for the second week in the month must be ordered by 4 p.m. CST Monday prior to the want-week, in this case Monday of the first week of the month. Specific want-dates (see "What is a Want-Date?") within the "want-week" are required to be specified on the equipment order as well. LOGs equipment may be ordered several weeks in advance for ease of doing business. Please contact your equipment manager for details, or LOGs Manager.

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What is a Want-Date?

The want-date is the date a car is requested to be placed at an industry.

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Do I have to order the entire amount of my LOGs commitment each week?

There are two options that can be utilized by LOGs holders to avoid penalties when they do not need the entire weekly quantity of LOGs cars:

BNSF allows a 10% car ordering deviation that can be either more or less than your weekly LOGs equipment commitment. Example: If your weekly LOGs commitment is 10 cars, you may order between eight or 12 cars in any given week without incurring a LOGs penalty for that week. Ordering less cars than the LOGs commitment in any week(s) does not release the LOGs permit holder from meeting the overall LOGs commitment. See BNSF Rules Book-7 for specific rules regarding transfers.

Alternatively, customers can transfer LOGs to other customers in any quantity desired (up to the LOGs committed quantity). (See "How do customers transfer LOGs?")

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Can customers change an equipment request after the Monday deadline has passed?

This is subject solely to BNSF approval. Customers desiring to alter equipment orders after the deadline must contact their BNSF equipment manager for approval. Such changes if authorized will result in forfeiture of the guarantee and LOG discount, if applicable. See BNSF Rules Book-7 for specific rules regarding changes.

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What happens with Bad Order cars?

Once spotted, bad ordered equipment would be replaced as soon as possible or within seven (7) days of the want-date. The LOG will still be valid on the car and will be paid when shipped.

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Can the LOGs permit be changed to a different origin region?

No, there are no cross region transfers or changes.

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How do I order BNSF equipment if I am located on a shortline or other Class I railroad?

Our plan is for the customer to continue to request equipment through their serving rail carrier contact as today, except utilizing the LOGs Equipment Request Form. This form will specify the fact that a LOG equipment request is being made and provide the LOG permit number to the serving rail carrier. LOGs obligation is considered satisfied upon the offer of equipment to the serving rail carrier or shortline by BNSF.

Please note: LOGs Refrigerated boxcar equipment may only be ordered by customers located on BNSF or affiliated shortlines. Customers located on other Class I railroads are not eligible to order LOGs equipment, however standard ordering options are available.

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Getting Your Freight Discount (where applicable)


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How Do I know if I get a freight discount?

Rates that are eligible for incentives will be noted in the Price Documents. The LOGs freight discounts are available to any shipper for movement on the applicable price documents listed as LOGs discount eligible. NOT EVERY COMMODITY, RATE DOCUMENT OR EQUIPMENT TYPE IS ELIGIBLE. Please check the Price Documents to see of your document is eligible. If you have questions concerning applicable documents contact the Manager of LOGs at 817-867-LOGS.

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If I am eligible for freight discounts, how much and how many do I get?

The dollar amount of a LOGs freight deduction is based on the commodity shipped, the number of weeks of your commitment (4, 5, 13, 26 or 52 weeks), the equipment type, and when you place your bid through your myBNSF account.

The number of total deductions you will receive is calculated by multiplying the number of weeks bought times the number of cars per week. Example: a four week permit for 10 cars a week equals 40 deductions.

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How does a customer bill a LOGs car when claiming a LOGs discount?

Customers will need to submit Internet Shipping Instructions via traditional EDI or the BNSF e.Business page. If you do not have electronic bill of lading capabilities, you can contact us at 888-428-2673 or contact LOGs Manager if you have other types of electronic billing arrangements.
A Forest Products Permit field has been added to the Internet Bill of Lading format. Customers must enter their LOGs permit number into the Forest Products Permit field. Without the permit number field entered with your correct permit number you WILL NOT receive the LOGs discount. For mainframe bill of lading users, REN has a Forest Products Permit field. If you have any questions, contact the Manager of LOGs at 817-867-LOGS (5647).

When billing the cars the permit number MUST be placed in the correct field on the bill of lading.

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Permit Changes/Transfer


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How do customers transfer LOGs?

A LOG and any applicable discount associated with a LOGs can be transferred two ways:

  1. Where one party allows another party temporary use of their permit on an ad-hoc basis without a change in obligation.
  2. Where a permanent transfer is negotiated for all or part of the weekly obligation for duration of the permit shipping period.

Under temporary transfers the LOG remains the right and obligation of the original LOG holder, the transferee becomes an authorized user of the permit number as agreed upon by themselves and the LOGs permit holder. Under a permanent transfer, the original permit is modified to reflect the reduced commitment and a new permit number is issued to the transferee reflecting the transferred rights and obligations.

Once a transfer has been negotiated between parties, the transferor will e-mail to add the transferee company to their permit as an authorized user. The transferee company then uses the transferred permit number to order the negotiated quantity of LOGs equipment (using LOGs equipment request types) into the desired facility, with the usual advance notice. If a freight discount is applicable on the permit, the transferee company also places the permit number on the BOL and their freight bill is created net of the discount amount.

Deadline for Transfers is 4 p.m. Friday prior to the equipment ordering deadline of 4 p.m. Monday.

LOGs can be transferred in any quantity. All transfers must be approved by BNSF by contacting the LOGs Manager at 817-867-LOGs or e-mail .

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What is the LOGs Bulletin Board?

The LOGs bulletin board is a secondary market arena to facilitate transfers of LOGs between shippers. Individual equipment offers and wants can be posted for possible transfer. BNSF is not responsible for 3rd party transactions. The LOGs Bulletin Board is a tab on the main LOGs page.

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Can a LOGs holder allow a third party the rights of guaranteed car supply without a change in rights or obligation?

In order to facilitate customer cooperatives, LOGs holders may assign the rights for LOGs equipment to other shippers without the transfer of obligation. (See "How do customers transfer LOGs?")

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Will BNSF repurchase a LOG?

No. Customers may transfer their LOGs obligation. (See "How do customers transfer LOGs?")

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How will LOGs treat weeks of Railroad holidays?

LOGs weekly commitment can be prorated based on working days for that week if requested. To have the commitment prorated, e-mail the .

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Miscellaneous


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  1. Are shortlines involved?
  2. Are reloads involved?
  3. Where can I go to view the orders that I’ve placed?
  4. How do I know if my equipment requests are for LOGS cars or just regular cars?
  5. What’s the difference between LOGS requested cars and regular cars?
  6. What if I don’t receive a LOGS requested car on time?
  7. How can I see the car numbers for my equipment requests?
  8. How do I know which cars have counted towards my LOGS commitment for an open
    permit period?
  9. Where can I view a summary of my LOGS permit activity by week?
  10. How can I track whether I’m fulfilling my LOGS commitment?
  11. How can I see if my commitment quantity was increased / decreased?
  12. How can I see who cancelled or reduced any of my requests?
  13. How can I request a reduction in my commitment quantity during holidays?
  14. How do I get a confirmation for the cars that I requested on my LOGS permit number?
  15. Will I be notified if I’m not meeting my LOGS commitment?
  16. What happens if I failed to meet my LOGS commitment on a permit?
  17. Who will be issued the LOGS penalty bill?
  18. How can I view any outstanding or adjusted penalty bills?
  19. How can I dispute a LOGS penalty bill?
  20. How can I track the cars shipped and freight deductions?
  21. Where can I find the latest version of the LOGS Rules Book?

1. Are shortlines involved?

Yes. Our desire is to include all regional railroads supplied with BNSF centerbeam equipment and having single factor (non-joint-line) rates published in LOGs price documents to be involved.

2. Are reloads involved?

Yes, by utilizing BNSF-owned or -leased equipment a customer may satisfy LOGs shipment obligations in two ways:

  • Customer ships BNSF controlled equipment from the reload utilizing LOGs qualifying price documents (LOGs qualifying documents are any BNSF published document) for rail transportation only. Under this scenario customer would have satisfied their commitment to BNSF to ship the car under the LOGs program and customer would be eligible for the freight discount, if rate document qualifies for LOGs discount.
  • Customer ships BNSF controlled equipment from the reload utilizing reload price documents.  Under this scenario customer would have satisfied their commitment to BNSF to ship the car under the LOGs program but would not be eligible for the freight discount since shipment was not moved under a LOGs discount eligible rate document.

3. Where can I go to view the orders that I’ve placed?

You can view your “Order History” on BNSF.com. Under the “Ship” tab click on “Railcar
Equipment Request.” All current equipment requests will be listed. You can click on
“Summary History” to get information for prior equipment requests up to 90 days. You may
need to specify the Company Name or choose the Facility if you are a multiple site user or a
“Broker.”

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4. How do I know if my equipment requests are for LOGS cars or just regular cars?

Under “Summary History” on the far right of the screen under the “Order Type” column it
specifies whether you requested LOGS or regular cars by permit number.

5. What’s the difference between LOGS requested cars and regular cars?

LOGS orders are filled at a higher priority before other car requests and BNSF
guarantees to fulfill that equipment request by the 2nd service day after the want date. With
the recent rise in equipment demands, please be sure to use your LOGS permit number so
you can be guaranteed to receive your requested car. If you fail to use your LOGS permit
number at the time of requesting equipment, it could result in unavailability of cars.

6. What if I don’t receive a LOGS requested car on time?

If BNSF fails to place a car by 2nd service day after the want date you may submit a
claim. Claims must be submitted within 30 days of service failure by logging on to “LOGS
Claims” and click on “Create a New Claim.”

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7. How can I see the car numbers for my equipment requests?

Under “Summary History” on the far right of the screen, click on “Details” to see the car
numbers.

8. How do I know which cars have counted towards my LOGS commitment for an open
permit period?

In the LOGS Customer View, the quantity of cars listed in the “Order Type” column count
towards fulfilling your LOGS commitment. This information is derived directly from the
Railcar Equipment Request (RER) system when you request a car using your permit
number. Cars requested without a permit order do not counts towards your LOGS
commitment.

9. Where can I view a summary of my LOGS permit activity by week?

In the LOGS Customer View you’ll need to input your permit number. Scroll to the
bottom of the screen and click the green “Summary” button. Scroll down to “Order Details.”

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10. How can I track whether I’m fulfilling my LOGS commitment?

In the LOGS Customer View go to “Order Details,” you’ll need to compare the “Planned
Order Quantity” against the “Equipment Ordered Quantity. The “Planned Order Quantity”
reflects your weekly commitment and the “Equipment Ordered Quantity” reflects what you
actually requested through RER using your permit number.

11. How can I see if my commitment quantity was increased / decreased?

In the LOGS Customer View, you’ll need to input your permit number. Scroll to the
bottom of the screen and click the green “Summary” button. Scroll down to “Additional Info
/ Comments” and review the information.

12. How can I see who cancelled or reduced any of my requests?

In the LOGS Customer View, you’ll need to input your permit number. Scroll to the
bottom of the screen and click the green “Summary” button. Scroll down to “Additional Info
/ Comments” and review any 633 Associations. The 633 Associations represent third party
facilities for which you’ve granted permit access. You, along with any 633 Associations listed
on your permit, can make changes to your equipment requests.

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13. How can I request a reduction in my commitment quantity during holidays?

Requests for a holiday reductions (1 car for every 5 car order commitment) must be
submitted via email to logs.marketing@bnsf.com by Monday 4:00 p.m. CST prior to the
LOGS equipment want-week.

14. How do I get a confirmation for the cars that I requested on my LOGS permit number?

You will need to save the “group number” issued through RER at the time equipment is
requested.

15. Will I be notified if I’m not meeting my LOGS commitment?

During the permit period you will be notified monthly via email when you’ve fallen short
of your weekly commitment.

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16. What happens if I failed to meet my LOGS commitment on a permit?

Within 30 days after the permit expiration, you will be billed for any commitment
shortfall. The penalty is $200 per car or $100 for 52-week lumber and panel permits.

17. Who will be issued the LOGS penalty bill?

The LOGS permit holder will be billed for penalties. Any third party facilities will not be
held accountable for commitment shortfalls.

18. How can I view any outstanding or adjusted penalty bills?

Under the BNSF web applications, log on to “Account Status”, click on “Account Status
Admin” and input your patron code. Any outstanding bills will be displayed and any
cancelled bills will be not be displayed

19. How can I dispute a LOGS penalty bill?

Under the BNSF web applications, go to the “Manage” tab and log onto “Account Status.”
After inputting the patron code, click on the blue number next to the bill you want to
dispute, check the box next to the amount for dispute, and click the button “Register
Dispute”, select your reason for dispute and type in your notes. In your dispute notes,
please provide specific details about any cars ordered under your expired LOGS permit
number.

20. How can I track the cars shipped and freight deductions?

In the LOGS Customer View input your permit number and the first screen displays
information on cars shipped and freight deductions.

21. Where can I find the latest version of the LOGS Rules Book?

To access the Rules Book, click here

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